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  #76  
Old 09-21-2008, 08:36 PM
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wyndhy wyndhy is offline
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not really^^
it's not a shortage. it's spot shortages. if peeps would stop topping off every time they see somewhere has gas, instead of resuming the old routine of filling up when close to empty, this would not be happening.
and nat'l media lose interest in anything not life threatening, low-down, or political in 12 hours flat. ABC nightly couldn't care less anymore, so i don't know why some station a thousand miles away would care either.
AAA still cares.

scotz, i heard AAA is predicting this problem will last til the end of this week. dig in, dude.
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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose
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  #77  
Old 09-22-2008, 04:35 AM
jseal jseal is offline
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wyndhy,

Could be. At least that provides a plausible explanation.
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  #78  
Old 09-22-2008, 07:52 AM
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not could be. is. do a search using tennessee news sources and you'll find the info.
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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose
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  #79  
Old 09-22-2008, 09:38 AM
jseal jseal is offline
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wyndhy,

Thank you. Would you PM or post those links? I’d like to see what they have to say.
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  #80  
Old 09-22-2008, 09:40 AM
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Lord Snow Lord Snow is offline
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You do have a point. It's only middle Tennessee with the problem. Nashville, Murfreesboro, Smyrna, Franklin.......
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  #81  
Old 09-22-2008, 01:47 PM
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wyndhy wyndhy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jseal
wyndhy,

Thank you. Would you PM or post those links? I’d like to see what they have to say.

then you should have looked for them.
however, i took a moment to search for you. keywords tennessee and spot shortage. this was the most recent http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs...379/1006/NEWS01

not for nuthin, jseal, but even when i tell my 7yo how and where to get the info she seeks, she at least makes an attempt.
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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose
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  #82  
Old 09-22-2008, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyndhy
then you should have looked for them.
however, i took a moment to search for you. keywords tennessee and spot shortage. this was the most recent http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs...379/1006/NEWS01

not for nuthin, jseal, but even when i tell my 7yo how and where to get the info she seeks, she at least makes an attempt.

wyndhy,

While your rebuke was unjustified, I do thank you for substantiating your claims.
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  #83  
Old 09-22-2008, 03:14 PM
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of course it was unjustified. i have no authority over you, and therefore no responsibility to give you a lesson in consideration, listening or research skills. but it was not unreasonable - i never said i had any links to share, and i did not offer any. you did not ask where i read or heard such info but intesad assumed i had the time and the inclination to search out old (to me) information and pass it on in a manner most convenient for you, with the rather insulting implication that i would claim something is true without any basis.

you're backhanded thanks are unnecessary. i did not provide it to substantiate my claim, as you say. but you are most welcome, anyhow - for the time i took from my day to provide you with easy access to a reasonable source that i believed contained enough information to satisfy your curiosity.
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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose
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  #84  
Old 09-22-2008, 04:50 PM
jseal jseal is offline
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wyndhy,

Your criticism is unjustified. I did not, by asking you to substantiate your claim, imply that you were in any way being dishonest. It is perfectly reasonable to ask someone the source of their information. In conversation, this often takes the form of “Where did you hear that?” In a written discussion such as this it is reasonable to provide a url as the source of the information. If you would not be insulted when someone asks “Where did you hear that?” in one conversation, why would you feel insulted when someone else asks “Where did you learn that?” in another?

I did not know what search engine you used for your search, or what you used for your search. Changing either or both could well have changed the results. We have already seen in this thread what can happen when mistakes are made. By using the same url as you did, I would be minimizing the likelihood of another.

I have attempted to remain courteous in posts, even when I disagreed with the opinions posted by others. I would appreciate it if you would extend the same consideration to me.
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  #85  
Old 09-22-2008, 05:25 PM
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wyndhy wyndhy is offline
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fair enough. i will remain courteous. i will not use rolling-on-the-floor-laughing smilies, or rolling-eyes smilies or sarcasm or taunts.
again you declare me unjustified. this time i will justify myself.

i never said i had any links to share, only that i knew this information to be true and felt sure you could find this information as well. if you had cared to ask where i heard it, i would have gladly said on a short mid-show news and info segment on npr while i was driving to get my license renewed. instead, you thanked me for a suggestion you did not use and with no please, you asked would you pm or post those links? and so i found one, and posted it - quite courteous to do so, i felt - with a minor reprimand for your thoughtless assumption that i could just cut and paste and that would be that. for my trouble, i gained a thanks from you with the qualification that the thanks was for my ability to substantiate my claim, not for the time i took to search, or the lengthy article i culled which was chalk full of information and sources and spokesmen which i know you prefer.

i can be as cooly polite as the next person, but i will not be shamed into feeling unjustified in giving you a proper set down for your arrogant assumption that i was substantiating a claim instead of doing you a favor. and i am too smart not to recognize veiled insults.
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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose
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  #86  
Old 09-22-2008, 06:48 PM
jseal jseal is offline
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wyndhy,

It is good to read that you will be courteous, and I share your confidence in the reliability of NPR news reporting.

As you did not indicate the source of your “not could be. is.”, it seemed reasonable to ask you the source of your assertion. That was an absolute claim. Within the context of this thread, where other truth claims have been made, and then left unsupported, I am surprised that you expected your assertion to be assumed true. I hoped you would be able to substantiate your claim, as doing so would move the discussion forward. My response “Thank you. Would you PM or post those links? I’d like to see what they have to say.” still seems innocuous to me. I believe you over reacted, although you disagree.

I do think that shared references (if they can be agreed upon) are very useful to explore a subject, as they help reduce ambiguity. This may help explain why I prefer a common url to a generalized directive. Your initial statement “i took a moment to search” does seem to be at odds with the subsequent “not for the time i took to search, or the lengthy article i culled which was chalk full of information”.

My reading of your posting history lead me to conclude that you do not believe you think your opinions may not be questioned. Perhaps I was mistaken, but I still believe it. Do you feel that I am arrogant to expect that those with whom I discuss subjects I wish to better understand should be able to support their positions? Perhaps this is where I disagree with you, and with others. I believe that when people make a truth claim, then they should be able to substantiate their claim, either with explanation or evidence.
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  #87  
Old 09-22-2008, 07:52 PM
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Lilith Lilith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jseal
I believe that when people make a truth claim, then they should be able to substantiate their claim, either with explanation or evidence.


There is a difference between a truth claim and an opinion or view and no one, no one, needs to justify a damn thing to you here, ever. You are not owed or entitled to evidence or explanations. This is NOT a debate forum and if you are going to continue to reduce every conversation here to links and quibbling than I suggest you find a place to go that encourages debate.
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  #88  
Old 09-22-2008, 08:05 PM
jseal jseal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilith
There is a difference between a truth claim and an opinion or view ...

Lilith,

Yes mam, I agree with you.
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  #89  
Old 09-22-2008, 08:31 PM
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WildIrish WildIrish is offline
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I wanna kiss you in Paris
I wanna hold your hand in Rome
I wanna run naked in a rainstorm
Make love in a train cross-country
You put this in me
So now what, so now what?

Wanting, needing, waiting
For you to justify my love
Hoping, praying
For you to justify my love
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  #90  
Old 09-22-2008, 09:09 PM
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wyndhy wyndhy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jseal
Do you feel that I am arrogant to expect that those with whom I discuss subjects I wish to better understand should be able to support their positions?

yes, it is arrogant that you believe anyone you challenge should be responsible for providing you with information that would help you better understand. that they even care whether or not you think they have supported their posotion, and that said information must be sourced as well as being subject to your approval. it is provoking, the way you challenge certain statements to debate and censure and it is deliberately provoking because most of the ones you single out are made in obviously exaggerated complaint. it is rude the way you sound falsely polite and innocently interested when you ask for proof. and it’s pitiful, the need you had to research my post history. (and personally insulting, since we’ve had many discussions ourselves and i have been courteous, non-disparaging, and broad-minded.)

i respect your intelligence. i admire your interest in world and local events, past and present. i love that you take the time to say happy birthday to pixies with a colorful thread and warm wishes. as i said, we have had several lively discussions ourselves and i enjoy them until you whine about my tone because i have pointed out a place where i believe you were the one whose words or actions were unjustified. i would not challenge people in the way that you do. when people are having a discussion, there is nothing to be so affronted by. when people ask in conversation, as you said, “where did you hear that?” they do not add “and i doubt you heard it anywhere reasonable” before they get the answer. they do not worry about shared references. they do not yell or laugh at or hound someone who’s said they don’t want to talk. not if they expect people to continue to want to speak to them, or even tolerate their presence.

you said you are aware of the difference between opinion and fact but you are a very poor judge of when someone is actually claiming they are stating a fact or making a half-joke. and a very poor judge of humans in general if you believe that false kindness will go unmarked as the dismissal it really is and that people will want to respond to you, moving the conversation forward in an interesting way, when you speak to them with such acerbic self-importance. or perhaps you do know the difference, but choose to ignore it. i certainly feel that you know the difference between discussion and debate, but you choose to blur that line as well.

my father once asked me, "how do you see people? mostly good, or mostly bad?" i said mostly good. he told me i was naive. in for a lot of disappointment. that people would always be trying to take advantage. but he was wrong about how it would make me feel when that happened. when i give people the benefit of doubt, it is not my own doubt that benefits.
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Trees give peace to the souls of men * Nora Waln

The forest would be very quiet if no other birds sang than those who sing the best * Henry van Dyke

some fairly sordid tales, rambles, and anecdotes
Hypothetically Speaking * Something More * Cammy Interrupted * An Experimental Vacation * Masked * so..damn..hot * Thank You * My toy, his idea * no.19 Maple Lane * I Have A Surprise For You * Yesterday * In a Quiet Kitchen * help me decide * untitled prose * more untitled prose
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